Just wanted your opinions on how they are looking i tried to get better pictures but they wont stay still they run around all the time
Hi,
I would say that they do look healthy and well however looking at their growth they are growing a bit quickly. Their new growth is higher up than old growth which means they have had a good period of slow smooth growth and then a bit of a quicker period.
It is easy to give them too much of the good food so I monitor mine by weighing them after a bath (Where they have defecated & urinated) and aim for 1-2 grams a week weight gain. It's very easily done so you shouldn't feel bad, just keep it in mind in the future. I also make sure that my smaller torts have a humid hide to go into at night which often helps with their smooth growth. I know some experts say that this goes against what people already know about tortoises, however I can honestly say that my tortoises have grown much smoother since being offered a humid hide and my yearlings which have been on this regime from day one are smooth as the day they left the egg.
Are these from a breeder or pet shop? Their growth would suggest that at first they where kept in brilliant conditions and grew at the appropriate weight, then it has speeded up again, slowed down and started growing fast again. Where they not hibernated for their first year?
Josh
they were from a breeder and she had hibernated them in the first year.she also said that she kept them outside where unfortunatley with me they get two to maybe three hours aday outside and the rest of the time indoors in the table under a 10 uvb tube and a 100 watt basking lamp that i set to 28 degrees as my house is quite warm. They never seem to bask when im about and when i start the lights up in the morning they are feeding soon as the temp reaches 24 degree it goes down to 20 at night. They have grown a fair bit since i have had them so i feel i am responsible for this fast growth maybe i feed them to much or could it be there change in habitat? i use a soil as substrate as advised by my breeder i give them nutrobol every other day and i cover the food in limestone flour everyday as advised. Is this acceleration the start of pyramiding and can i put this right? Any advise you could give me on the matter would be much appreciated.
Hi there clint paul
It's so scary this whole thing about pyramiding!! I'm new to this too and thought i had read up very well on how to care for my baby leopards but it can be so hard to get good advice. your torts look lovely and good luck with them.
(08-12-2010 04:07 PM)shelley Wrote: [ -> ]Hi there clint paul
It's so scary this whole thing about pyramiding!! I'm new to this too and thought i had read up very well on how to care for my baby leopards but it can be so hard to get good advice. your torts look lovely and good luck with them.
Hi it is scary as i wanna get it right with them as we see them as a life time commitment so in away they are part of the family now. They have brought alot of joy to the house and are little characters! when i text my wife to say morning as im up and out the house before her i find myself asking how the torts are too. I saw the picture of your tort on the other page and its a beauty very colourful, it made me want one of them too
but i would never be allowed plus these two have got my hands full at the moment
Hi,
As long as you slow down the growth no harm will be done as it is still early days. Why are they only out for 2-3 hours a day? This could well be the reason he is growing too quick as they will not be grazing naturally and will not have as much room to exercise either. Can you not build them a permanent outdoor enclosure as 2-3 hours a day is not ideal.
Josh
(08-12-2010 05:38 PM)tortoise_dude Wrote: [ -> ]Hi,
As long as you slow down the growth no harm will be done as it is still early days. Why are they only out for 2-3 hours a day? This could well be the reason he is growing too quick as they will not be grazing naturally and will not have as much room to exercise either. Can you not build them a permanent outdoor enclosure as 2-3 hours a day is not ideal.
Josh
Im at work from 6am every morning apart from the weekends when they spend all day outside i get home everyday at 4pm in the week but they go to sleep come 6pm so i bring them in then, If my wife is home she puts them outside but she isnt always here i would like to keep them outside but unfortunatley this area has become a target for robberies of recent
which has pretty much forced us into a move the end of this month then i can hopefully sort out an all day enclosure without the fear of them being stolen. So i take it to slow the growth down i need to offer less food?
(08-12-2010 02:53 PM)clintpaul Wrote: [ -> ]they were from a breeder and she had hibernated them in the first year.she also said that she kept them outside where unfortunatley with me they get two to maybe three hours aday outside and the rest of the time indoors in the table under a 10 uvb tube and a 100 watt basking lamp that i set to 28 degrees as my house is quite warm. They never seem to bask when im about and when i start the lights up in the morning they are feeding soon as the temp reaches 24 degree it goes down to 20 at night. They have grown a fair bit since i have had them so i feel i am responsible for this fast growth maybe i feed them to much or could it be there change in habitat? i use a soil as substrate as advised by my breeder i give them nutrobol every other day and i cover the food in limestone flour everyday as advised. Is this acceleration the start of pyramiding and can i put this right? Any advise you could give me on the matter would be much appreciated.
Hi Clint
I think the lowered new growth rate is more than a few weeks old. They look to have grown well in the first instance and then the new growth is completely different, sitting much lower down. The basking spot should be 30 degrees as background temps do nothing to warm torts as they are cold blooded and only warm up when directly under the basking spot - this is essential for correct digestion of food. Don't use a thermostat on the basking lamp as it needs to be used at will by the tortoise. When they are too hot they will move out of it just the same as they do with the sun. Limestone should be given seperatley so the tortoise can take it at will and nutrobal MUST be given daily to growing tortoises, only reducing the frequency when they are adult and no longer growing at the same rate.
As you have only had them a couple of weeks you should not have seen any noticeable growth at all to be honest. Try offering less food and more nutrobal. Rememebr it needs to be given at the rate of one pinch per Kilo of tortoise.
Pyramiding cannot be rectified but is less noticeable as they grow if caught early enough.
Hope this helps
(08-12-2010 06:41 PM)wizzasmum Wrote: [ -> ] (08-12-2010 02:53 PM)clintpaul Wrote: [ -> ]they were from a breeder and she had hibernated them in the first year.she also said that she kept them outside where unfortunatley with me they get two to maybe three hours aday outside and the rest of the time indoors in the table under a 10 uvb tube and a 100 watt basking lamp that i set to 28 degrees as my house is quite warm. They never seem to bask when im about and when i start the lights up in the morning they are feeding soon as the temp reaches 24 degree it goes down to 20 at night. They have grown a fair bit since i have had them so i feel i am responsible for this fast growth maybe i feed them to much or could it be there change in habitat? i use a soil as substrate as advised by my breeder i give them nutrobol every other day and i cover the food in limestone flour everyday as advised. Is this acceleration the start of pyramiding and can i put this right? Any advise you could give me on the matter would be much appreciated.
Hi Clint
I think the lowered new growth rate is more than a few weeks old. They look to have grown well in the first instance and then the new growth is completely different, sitting much lower down. The basking spot should be 30 degrees as background temps do nothing to warm torts as they are cold blooded and only warm up when directly under the basking spot - this is essential for correct digestion of food. Don't use a thermostat on the basking lamp as it needs to be used at will by the tortoise. When they are too hot they will move out of it just the same as they do with the sun. Limestone should be given seperatley so the tortoise can take it at will and nutrobal MUST be given daily to growing tortoises, only reducing the frequency when they are adult and no longer growing at the same rate.
As you have only had them a couple of weeks you should not have seen any noticeable growth at all to be honest. Try offering less food and more nutrobal. Rememebr it needs to be given at the rate of one pinch per Kilo of tortoise.
Pyramiding cannot be rectified but is less noticeable as they grow if caught early enough.
Hope this helps
Hi thanks for the reply when i got in from work tonight i put a thermometer on the substrate under the lamp and despite the fact i run it a 28 degree its actually 30 degree underneath which is abit of a bonus after what you have just said, As i had said above they do not seem to bask at all and when i have put them out in direct sunlight i have noticed they look to the shade not long after exposure i have been monitering my temps religously since i have had them. When i got them one was considerably bigger than the other but me and my wife have noticed this sudden size increase in them and that is why i posted on here as i have been alarmed by it they have also changed colour a little bit as the shells have got lighter i have also noticed they have been shedding the skin on there head over the past week. I have to hold my hands up and say i may of been a little over generous with the food and i will now address the issue.
(08-12-2010 06:51 PM)clintpaul Wrote: [ -> ] (08-12-2010 06:41 PM)wizzasmum Wrote: [ -> ] (08-12-2010 02:53 PM)clintpaul Wrote: [ -> ]they were from a breeder and she had hibernated them in the first year.she also said that she kept them outside where unfortunatley with me they get two to maybe three hours aday outside and the rest of the time indoors in the table under a 10 uvb tube and a 100 watt basking lamp that i set to 28 degrees as my house is quite warm. They never seem to bask when im about and when i start the lights up in the morning they are feeding soon as the temp reaches 24 degree it goes down to 20 at night. They have grown a fair bit since i have had them so i feel i am responsible for this fast growth maybe i feed them to much or could it be there change in habitat? i use a soil as substrate as advised by my breeder i give them nutrobol every other day and i cover the food in limestone flour everyday as advised. Is this acceleration the start of pyramiding and can i put this right? Any advise you could give me on the matter would be much appreciated.
Hi Clint
I think the lowered new growth rate is more than a few weeks old. They look to have grown well in the first instance and then the new growth is completely different, sitting much lower down. The basking spot should be 30 degrees as background temps do nothing to warm torts as they are cold blooded and only warm up when directly under the basking spot - this is essential for correct digestion of food. Don't use a thermostat on the basking lamp as it needs to be used at will by the tortoise. When they are too hot they will move out of it just the same as they do with the sun. Limestone should be given seperatley so the tortoise can take it at will and nutrobal MUST be given daily to growing tortoises, only reducing the frequency when they are adult and no longer growing at the same rate.
As you have only had them a couple of weeks you should not have seen any noticeable growth at all to be honest. Try offering less food and more nutrobal. Rememebr it needs to be given at the rate of one pinch per Kilo of tortoise.
Pyramiding cannot be rectified but is less noticeable as they grow if caught early enough.
Hope this helps
Hi thanks for the reply when i got in from work tonight i put a thermometer on the substrate under the lamp and despite the fact i run it a 28 degree its actually 30 degree underneath which is abit of a bonus after what you have just said, As i had said above they do not seem to bask at all and when i have put them out in direct sunlight i have noticed they look to the shade not long after exposure i have been monitering my temps religusly since i have had them. When i got them one one considerably bigger than the other but me and my wife have noticed this sudden size increase in them and that is why i posted on here as i have been alarmed by it they have also changed colour a little bit as the shells have got lighter i have also noticed they have been shedding the skin on there head over the past week. I have to hold my hands up and say i may of been a little over generous with the food and i will now address the issue.
They look for shade after putting out as it is a new environment and they feel the need to hide until they have got a feel for it. This is one reason that a permanent outdoor area is quite important to avoid stressing them from continual moving. As you said the area is not safe though, you obviously have to prioritise this. Make sure that the area you put them in outdoors is the same one each time and if possible take their whole table outdoors to avoid changing too much for them. If they lived outdoors permanently you would find they behaved just the same if you brought them indoors occasionaly, they are funny little things and this behaviour is one that shows us that they are essentially wild animals
The lighter shell growth is normal - it's always lighter on hermanns and horsfields to begin with and then it changes to theri normal colouration as it settles down. In hermanns, noticeable skin shedding is a sign of too fast growth - in horsfields it's normal. Just make sure they have the daily nutrobal as this is what it was formulated for.